| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Torsten |
Posted - 09/21/2008 : 01:38:19 AM
I've been ruminating on this for two weeks now, and didn't want to make a post on our site until I'd had a chance to think this through.
I definitely understand the need for skill level evaluation forms and processes. But one of the things that really irks me is frivolous use of the process. If you've been a captain as long as I have, and many of you have been doing it longer, you're bound to get the occasional beef with how one of your players is ranked. It might just be sour grapes, or it might be legitimate.
Anyway, my point is, there are folks who frequently ask for players to be evaluated, and it's generally without merit. This ticks me off. Our system, while imperfect, is as fair as you could hope. Sure, you'll get a new 4 in the league who is really good and should be a 6 or 7. That will sort itself out soon enough. In recent weeks, I've had a new player beat my SL3 three games to none in two innings. The guy who won is darn good, but I have faith in the system. Same week, in 9 ball, an SL3 broke and ran against one of my players. Using side english and terrific pace manipulation for position, no less. But he's also fairly new, and I have faith that the system will rank him correctly once he's established himself with enough matches to form a track record.
My beef is this. My SL5 plays another SL 5, and the match is fairly even. They're both playing mediocre pool, as the innings showed. My SL 5 eventually lost the match. Same night, my SL 3 gets blown out of the water by a new player who is very good. Hey, tough tamales. That's how it gets. But you want to write on your scorecard that my SL5 and SL3 both need to be evaluated? Based on what? They both lost, and deservedly so, based on the superior play when it mattered or overall by their opponents. But then to tell me that it's irrelevant that they lost because of how they've played at some point in the past and that the evaluations are merited, and then follow it up with an assertion of "fact" that at best can be called dodgey, is wrong.
It's more than wrong. It's bad sportsmanship. What you're trying to do is get players wrongly promoted to a higher skill level to further your own chances at a later date. That is really the antithesis of what the APA is about, in my opinion.
I want to make it clear that on a personal level, I like the parties involved. But on an APA level, I can't condone the gamesmanship.
One last anecdote. Last season, I played against a gentleman who is in my opinion a GOOD SL 7, and had the match of my life. 4-0 win, very short innings, 2 break and runs. He or his team could easily have appealed to move me to a SL7, and you know what, I wouldn't have been able to argue. But all he did is tell me "you played like God", shook my hand, swatted me on the back, and went off to cheer the rest of his team on. Yeah, I played like a 7 that night. And it's definitely my goal to attain SL 7 in eight ball, but I want to earn it. My track record is pretty clear. I have NEVER played like that before. I'm solid, consistent, and competitive... if mediocre in my hand skills. But I'm working on that. All of my players work on their deficiencies as well. I know I want all of my players on my team to earn SL promotions, because it's a big deal. It shows improvement, and progress is a great thing. But not if it's artificial.
Anyway, long story even longer, stop using the SL write up sheets so @#$% frivolously. Remember the dang spirit of the game. I've rarely written anyone up for sportsmanship violations, because I understand frustrations, and 99% of the time, the transgressor realizes his/her actions might have been offensive and apologizes. Hey, fair enough. But you want to scribble on your scorecard surreptitiously that players on the other team need to be evaluated for no good reason, that's gamesmanship. It's poor sportsmanship. And if I continue to see it, regardless of the parties involved, I will report it, and campaign like Strom Thurmond filibustering out of a phonebook for action to be taken.
Thank you for reading my novel and let me know if any publishing houses are willing to publish a sequel to War and Peace.
I think the worst time to have a heart attack would be during a game of charades... or during a game of fake heart attack. |
| 5 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Torsten |
Posted - 09/23/2008 : 3:09:14 PM
Thank you for your responses. I just want to clarify, I DO think that the evaluation sheets have a purpose. They should be used when an evaluation might be warranted.
My beef, like Phil says, was the gamesmanship involved. Everytime we have played this particular team, they've put on their scorecard that my teammates need to be evaluated. My belief is that they're doing so to either a)get under my skin ((success)) or b) get my players prematurely raised in SL so the next time our teams meet up, my players will in theory be easier to beat.
But anyway, I didn't mention this in my previous post, and in no way did I mean to insinuate anything by accidentally omitting it. I know that Taz and Phil do their due diligence, and look into these things properly. If I hinted at anything otherwise, I apologize.
I love to play in this league because 99% of the time, your success is based on a combination of effort, good play, timely coaching, and some luck. It's that 1% where people try to affect the game by cheating or using gamesmanship that annoy me.
Thanks, you guys, for your responses. See you around the tables.
I think the worst time to have a heart attack would be during a game of charades... or during a game of fake heart attack. |
| Phil |
Posted - 09/23/2008 : 12:45:40 AM
There is no reason to get upset when a player on the opposing team shoots a great match, unless you believe that player is cheating to keep his/her skill level down. Even in that instance, it is not productive to inform your opponents that you are going to "write them up" or to do so right in front of them. As Torsten points out, this kind of thing amounts to gamesmanship, an attempt to affect the play of your opponent with psychological tactics.
If you feel the need to fill out an evaluation request, it is better to do that in private. For one, the player in question may go up on his/her own, and if that happens who gets blamed (besides me, of course)? The result is resentment between players in the league, which is never fun. Sometimes there's even some retaliatory action. Once in a while we get envelopes from both teams full of yellow forms, and we know darn well that most of them are BS. But guess what? We have no way of knowing which is the player that gave cause for concern in the first place.
Do the evaluation requests get abused? We get quite a few from certain individuals in the league, but we don't really consider it abuse. It's more like micro-management. To help you understand what I mean by that, I think I need to explain a little bit about how things work here in the office.
The Equalizer (or any handicap system, for that matter) does not predict how well you will shoot in future matches. It simply measures your ability based on how you shot in matches you have already played. For the system to raise a player's skill level, that player had to have already demonstrated the ability to play at the higher level. In other words, the system will not raise a 4 who has never shot like a 5 or higher. So obviously, people are going to see that 4 shoot like a 5 or a 6 before the system makes him a 5. That's when we get evaluation requests.
Here in the office, I review the skill level of every player on every team, EVERY week. Some get more attention than others, but everyone gets reviewed. If we get an evaluation request for a player, that player gets more attention that week. If I think I need to keep an eye on that player, I will set a flag in the system to remind me to take a closer look in subsequent weeks. If I think the player is going to achieve the next level on his/her own, I tend to do nothing but watch and let nature take its course. This is what happens in the vast majority of cases. Occasionally, however, a player will need a nudge to reach the higher level, and I provide that nudge if I think the player's performance warrants a promotion. This is commonly referred to as a player being "raised" or "bumped" (or "jacked up", my personal favorite  ).
That's it in a nutshell. A player's skill level goes up one of two ways - most of the time it's natural, but sometimes I move them up based on a history of performance if I think the system won't catch up to them on its own. Nobody ever goes up just because someone filled out a form. The forms are important to get players on the radar, but once they are on the radar it's up to the system and me.
Now, back to micro-managing. People who submit a lot of evaluation requests are usually right, but they almost ALWAYS think the player should be one skill level higher (as opposed to two or more). Most of the time the player eventually reaches that level, just not as quickly as the submitter would like. I really don't mind getting all those forms. I'm going to review all of the players anyway, and it's not hard at all to look a little closer at a few of them. If I had to look closely at everyone it would be quite time consuming, but we don't usually get more than a handful of requests each week, so it's no big deal.
Torsten's post was not about abuse or over-use of the forms, it was about people using the threat of an evaluation request as some sort of psychological weapon on league night. Hopefully, this reply has cleared up some misconceptions about the connection between the form and a skill level change. The forms are important, but players go up when they deserve to go up. So the next time someone threatens to "write your player up", hand them one of YOUR forms and say "go for it."
Phil
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| pepelviejo |
Posted - 09/22/2008 : 4:38:36 PM
I agree with Moose Dragon ... in order for the APA system to work, it needs the player's input. The skill level evaluation sheets need to be filled out, but NOT abused .. once in a while someone is going to be affected negatively by it.
I never used to fill out the sheets ... but I think it's our duty to keep the game FAIR ... and trust that the system will eventually rank the player correctly. I understand Torsten's frustations as well ... but we should continue filling out the sheets for the best interest of the league.
Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away!! |
| D-RACK |
Posted - 09/22/2008 : 12:14:45 PM
T-
I have been in the APA going on 11 years. Teams come and go....... Captains Change.....
Trust the system and don't let that 1 Captain chooses to abuse the system ... The APA (Phil&Taz) has a pretty good idea of what's going on, HELL its been god knows how many years they have been doing this...
I totally agree with you 100% I can shoot above a 6 and below it... Depends on the situation. Weekly fun depends on who, where, what time, and how many beers..... I know I am SL6 maybe a 4 at times.... HIgher levels Tournaments I really try to step up my game. I played like a 7 in the top shooter tournament in front of Phil he knows that performances like that from me a rare. I am still a 6... 
Trust me on this come own to Camarillo... MONDAY-FRIDAY lets go watch the level of competitiveness....I know T.O. Division can get pretty crazy hell i played in both.
Not to say Camarillo dosent have its intense nights towards the end of a season or playoffs . But for the most part I really cant think of any Captains tht use the SKL LVL EVAL Sheet on a regular basis.
BTW ..... If you everwanna get toether and shoot around LMK
D-RACK
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| Moose Dragon |
Posted - 09/22/2008 : 09:38:37 AM
Torsten,
I think I can actually feel your frustration coming off the screen. I agree that the skill level evalutation forms should not be abused. The only problem I have with a post as passionate as yours is that it might keep some team captians from filling out a skill level evaluation form because they don't want to be viewed as being too critical, or jumping the gun. That would have the opposite effect you intended.
When I am watching a player that I think might be a candidate for a higher skill level I remember what Phil told me. You have to look at everything not just that they are making balls. You have to consider their stance, stroke, body movement (or lack of), along with how well they shoot, their shot selection, and manipulation of the cue ball. Anyone can get hot and make shots they normally would not make.
If I feel a player is shooting 1 skill level above their current ranking I chalk it up to having a good night and remember to watch this person the next chance I get. When I feel like a player is playing 2 skill levels above their current ranking that is when I really watch them to see if they meet the criterea to go up a skill level. I keep in mind what Phil said and try to be as unbiased as I can. If in my opinion the player is playing 2 skill levels above their current rank than I fill out the form. My skill level evaluation forms usually fill up the whole page, and I try to tell Phil and Taz all of what I saw. I would like to think that I have never written the form with any malice, but we are all human and tend to let our emotions get away from us and even rule us from time to time. That is why I wait until the end of the evening, after leaving the bar, or even a few days later to write out my evaluation.
I have written my fair share of evaluation forms and will continue to do so because as a team captain and division rep I feel it is my duty to do so. I want this league to be as fair as it can be.
It is pretty obvious that the handicap system is working because of all the posts every season with teams looking for low level players.
I do hope your problem in this area is contained to just one person. |
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