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pfan
14 Posts |
 Posted - 10/26/2007 : 10:59:33 AM
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It's been a little slow on the discussion board lately so here's one that should get a little play.
After playing in the league for a few years, I've watched (and occasionally participated in) a few arguments about fouls. Some weren't IF a foul occurred but rather WHY call the foul? Case in point, shooting the eight ball into an obvious pocket without marking it first. Of course the shooter was aiming at it; of course everyone should know the rules. And of course, the opposing team can win that game by calling it. I've seen a lot of bad feelings arise from the ensuing arguments. SO maybe, like football or baseball, if an infraction occurs, should it be mandatory the foul be called and taken? Then, no sportmanship issues or unruly comments later on in the match. Thoughts?? (I'm not advocating either side). |
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Doug Gill
USA
92 Posts |
Posted - 10/26/2007 : 12:43:54 PM
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My thoughts (and yes contrary to popular opinion , I do have them every once in awhile)...........
Fouls are the result of someone breaking the rules/laws of the game. As such, just like reality's rules/laws, ingnorance of them is no excuse. They are there for a reason.
Following the rules makes sure that everyone is playing on as even a playing field as possible. Following the rules ALL the time does a couple of things.
1) Players get into the habit of playing this way and less likely to forget (and lose!) at crunch time...i.e. higher level tournament play.
2) Not everyone knows all, and sometimes forget, the rules. Some even think there are rules that in reality don't exist in our league. You would be helping not only your opponents but your new teammates to learn them.
Now....have I ever forgiven a player and not called a foul.....yes. Should I have done this? My teammates didn't think so!  Not everyone, even our league operators, likes all the rules. But...if push came to shove, following the rules will get you a favorable ruling. I shied away from saying "You win!" because sometimes "You lose!" because of the resulting backlash that may follow.
Everyone needs to remember that our league was set up and should be FUN! It is your choice whether you want to be a "hard case" and follow the letter of the law. All I will suggest is that you be consistant. Don't pick and choose when, where and against whom you are going to enforce "The Book".
Also, before I get my hiney in hot water with League Management...... in no way am I advocating not enforcing the rules!
Good Shooting All! |
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Torsten
USA
401 Posts |
Posted - 10/26/2007 : 2:10:32 PM
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Okay, here's the issue. I'll be the first person to let a new player on the opposing team slide on an inadvertent rule violation (double hit foul, marked pocket on the 8 etc). That, however, becomes a problem because people are less inclined to be that understanding at regionals or any HLT. Sure, by the time your team qualfies for a higher level tourney, a player is expected to have some grasp on the rules. The flip side is, I've been around for a while now, and I STILL have to refer to my APA handbook for clarification from time to time.
My recommendation would be this; If you're playing against an inexperienced player and feel like cutting them some slack when they accidentally goof up, at least explain. "Hey, I'm not gonna bust you on it, but technically that was a foul and here's why. We're all having fun here so not a big deal, but if and when you play in playoffs or a regionals tourney, those shots will be called fouls."
"When I die, I want to go peacefully in my sleep like my grandpa -- not screaming like the passengers in his car" |
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DavidJH
USA
9 Posts |
Posted - 10/26/2007 : 2:30:35 PM
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| I am always suprised when a player or captain, who has been in the APA for many years, doesn't understand that (or why) a double hit on the cue ball is a foul. I have often observed during a match someone striking the cue ball when the object ball is less than a half inch away (but not touching) and following through, resulting in a double hit. A couple times, after the match, I have explained to the player and captain what went on and recommended ways to avoid a double hit. I wouldn't usually call a foul on a player for this, unless the player was a high skill level, and even then, not unless I've asked someone to watch the hit. |
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Kerry Randolph
USA
172 Posts |
Posted - 10/26/2007 : 3:05:02 PM
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I view it a lot like Torsten. During the season I will let the smaller infractions slide. If it is an easy shot on the eight and they forget to mark it then no big deal. This has happened 5 or 6 times. If my player does it I go to the opposing captain and tell them it is their call no hard feelings either way. Only once has the other team taken the win.
Now during playoffs it is a different story. I tell the captain to watch the players because I will be calling all fouls , and that includes my players as well. Double hits are especially watched because we lost a pivotal match one year in playoffs by not having it watched and the player slopped in their ball on a double hit and also got great shape on the 8-ball. Live and learn on that one.
pfan, the rules require an agreed upon third party to watch a double hit. If there is no one specified to watch it there can be no foul. You can not let someone shoot and then say that was a double hit.
Like Doug says the rules are there for a reason. They should be followed, but they should not take away from the fun.
It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt |
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pfan
14 Posts |
Posted - 10/26/2007 : 5:23:23 PM
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(Kerry: I didnt make the double hit comment)
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Kerry Randolph
USA
172 Posts |
Posted - 10/27/2007 : 08:24:34 AM
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Oops, my bad dog!
It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt |
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pfan
14 Posts |
Posted - 10/27/2007 : 3:15:25 PM
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| Well, I think the majority of the comments here echo most players thoughts that we're all here to have fun and being a hard ass about the rules isn't the short road to that goal. But, almost every conflict and argument that I've seen and participated in has been due to the expectation that the other team should extend courtesies that are outside the rules. Sure, it's nice for me to say "forget that double tap" or "I knew you were shooting at that pocket" or "just replace the cue ball where you think it was." If everyone was on the same page with respect to sportsmanship, fine. If not, maybe the only thing we can agree on is the rulebook (?) and forego the different practice levels of sportsmanship. Might be the only way to reduce stupid arguments. |
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Should All Fouls be Called??
